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Katie: Hi there and welcome to the Wellness Mama podcast. I’m Katie from WellnessMama.com and I’m again on this episode with return visitor, Naveen Jain, to speak about why oral well being is so vital for general well being and why microbiome is vital. We additionally speak about parenting as we at all times are inclined to do. And if you happen to’re not acquainted already, Naveen is an intensely curious entrepreneur who will not be afraid to tackle audacious concepts that may assist humanity. He’s the creator of the award-winning ebook, Moonshots: Making a World of Abundance. And his present adventures are Viome and Moon Categorical. As a serial entrepreneur, he beforehand based Infospace, Intelius, and TalentWise, and now focuses on Viome, whose singular mission is to make sickness elective. They’ve an AI-driven platform that analyzes the interplay between meals, our microbiome, and our human cells with a purpose to develop exact vitamin and stop and reverse persistent illnesses.
And on this episode, we go deep on the oral microbiome, how 99% of the genes in our physique don’t come from our dad and mom however from the 100 trillion microbes that decision our our bodies residence, how oral well being pertains to general well being and intestine well being, what the oral microbiome is and enhance it, how oral well being is linked to issues like colorectal most cancers and coronary heart illness, why the micro organism in our mouth is said to digestion, nitric oxide manufacturing, and rather more. We speak about what biofilms are and what to do about them, the significance of issues like oral pre-, pro-, and post-biotics, the distinction between genes and gene expression, and the way gene expression is consistently altering, after which go deep on the subject of parenting, which is at all times a favourite matter for the 2 of us. So let’s be a part of Naveen. Naveen, welcome again!
Naveen: Nicely Katie, what a pleasure to be speaking to you. Each single time I speak to you, it brings again nice reminiscences and unbelievable power since you are simply such an ideal, constructive individual.
Katie: Thanks. I really feel the identical. And I feel again to our first lengthy dialog a few years in the past at an occasion the place we talked about the whole lot from parenting to very particular intestine microbes and the whole lot in between. And I’ve loved each dialog since then. And I’m excited to leap into this one.
Individuals may be acquainted with you already from our previous episodes that went actually deep on the subject of intestine well being and the way that pertains to the entire physique. I’ll be certain that to hyperlink to these within the present notes. If you happen to guys haven’t listened, yow will discover them at wellnessmama.fm. However immediately I’m actually excited to proceed the microbiome dialog in a few instructions that I really feel like are very related and that you just even have experience in. The primary being the subject of oral well being and the way this pertains to not solely intestine well being however the well being of the physique.
Dave: Hey Naveen, what you doing?
Katie: Hello Dave Asprey, for these of you which are listening in.
Dave: After all I can’t hear you as a result of no earbuds. However Katie, love you, you’re superior.
Katie: Hello Dave. What a enjoyable cameo. I’m doing fantastic. You look superior. It’s nice to see you.
Dave: Nice to see you.
Katie: You too.
Dave: I like what you do, I like what you do. If you happen to’re within the south, simply need you to listen to from me.
Katie: Superior. Nicely, thanks for hopping in. For these of you guys who aren’t watching, Dave Asprey has simply joined the dialog.
Naveen: All there good to proceed.
Katie: Nicely, I used to be going to say to proceed our dialog from our previous podcast, I really feel like we received such good depth on the intestine microbiome and the way this pertains to our entire physique and each facet of well being. And I really feel like one other actually vital matter right here that you’re additionally an skilled in is the subject of oral well being, which we all know additionally has a microbiome additionally pertains to intestine well being, but in addition impacts the physique in a myriad of various methods. So to begin off broad, perhaps simply stroll us by the idea of oral well being, the oral microbiome and the way this pertains to general well being.
Naveen: Initially, let’s simply initially step again and have a look at the human physique itself, proper? We’re so happy with who we’re as people with out realizing that 99 p.c of all of the genes in our physique don’t come from our mother and pa. These are the microbes that reside inside our intestine. They reside in our mouth and our ears and our scalp and throughout us 100 Trillion of those microbes that decision the people as residence
So we actually are to massive extent this strolling speaking ecosystem inside the bigger ecosystem we name universe. And any level of time we disturb this ecosystem Whether or not we’re disturbing our oral microbiome or we’re disturbing our intestine microbiome. We in truth find yourself making our physique sick and the reason being as a result of our physique has come to depend on these microbes to offer the vitamins that our physique wants. They’re the sensors for the human physique. They actually are telling when there’s something unhealthy is coming into the mouth, when one thing is bitter style, one thing is a foul style, that it’s the sign they ship out, they are saying spit this factor out or vomit it out. That is simply no good for you, proper?
So all these signaling are carried out by these microbes which are continuously interacting with the setting. So microbes and the setting work together collectively they usually work together with the human host that we’re as a bunch and these hundred million microbes that reside inside and on us.
What’s actually fascinating in regards to the oral well being is it’s actually a gateway to our digestive system. We as people are actually like a donor. There’s a tube that goes by us and there’s a entire physique that’s round us. The start of the tube is our mouth the place all of our oral microbiome resides. And what’s actually fascinating is that by way of the sorts of microbiome, there may be extra variety of microbiome in our mouth despite the fact that the amount of microbes is decrease than our intestine. However they’re extra numerous set of microbiome in our mouth than they’re in our intestine.
And identical to intestine, what occurs in your mouth doesn’t keep within the mouth. It truly impacts not solely our intestine microbiome, but in addition affect us as human beings. Actually, now the oral well being is instantly linked to our cardiovascular well being. As most individuals might or might not know, our oral microbes are the first producer of nitric oxide. As , the nitric oxide is totally wanted for rest of our vascular system and with out that, we could have coronary heart illness. And in reality, it additionally improves your sexual well being, let’s simply say, , very clearly nitric oxide additionally will increase the blood movement. The nitric, along with the oral microbiome, is instantly linked to metabolism, particularly diabetes.
And most of the microbes in our mouth are actually being instantly linked to Alzheimer. So when you might have leaky gums, as a result of our gums are the obstacles, when your gums are bleeding, all these microbes are actually going into the blood. And there’s a concept that these microbes are actually, in truth, infecting the blood-brain barrier, leads to the mind, and that causes the an infection. And after they analyze the individuals who die from Alzheimer, they see an amazing quantity of P. gingivalis and gingipain being produced in lots of of those individuals who have Alzheimer.
Actually, most of the oral microbes someday find yourself settling in our intestine. We, on daily basis, we as people are swallowing about 1.5 liter of saliva each single day. So which means we’re swallowing all of these oral microbes that go into our intestine. Usually these microbes would die within the abdomen due to the acidity. So usually the acid within the abdomen would kill many of those microbes, it’s not most of them.
However, , as an increasing number of persons are on anti-acid medication and taking Nexium and Pepsid, now we don’t have sufficient acidity in our abdomen to kill these microbes and these microbes find yourself settling within the intestine. Actually, a few the microbes like Fusobacterium nucleatum, which is an oral microbiome, when it finally ends up settling within the intestine, turns into primary predictor of colorectal most cancers. So the colorectal most cancers in truth is attributable to Fusobactin nucleatum, which occurs to be an oral microbiome.
In order you possibly can see that despite the fact that now we have… now we have our kidney and now we have a coronary heart, these are all interconnected. It’s not that what out of the blue occurs in your mouth goes to remain within the mouth and what’s occurring within the intestine stays within the intestine. All of our programs are interacting with one another. And we as human physique are additionally interacting with the setting. So we actually must care for the environment as a result of that additionally impacts who we’re.
Katie: Yeah, I really feel that is such a captivating matter. I first received into researching this a few years in the past, truly, once I discovered I had a couple of small cavities and I used to be pregnant on the time, so I didn’t need to get them crammed. And through that point I used to be pregnant, we ended up transferring and I received a brand new dentist. And after they did the oral examination, I didn’t have cavities anymore. And till that time, I had been instructed that cavities may by no means heal. So I used to be fascinated by what had occurred.
And I began researching and studying in regards to the oral microbiome and the way, simply to the touch on the floor stage of what you simply defined, there’s all these trillions of micro organism occurring within the physique, however within the mouth particularly, it looks as if there’s competing micro organism and it might go pathogenic in considered one of two methods. So it might go in direction of the strep mutans space, which is the cavity forming micro organism or in direction of the gingivitis strains of micro organism. And so they’re each opportunistic. So that they don’t usually exist on the identical time. So that you’ll usually see one downside or the opposite. However that made me suppose, in fact, which means we will hopefully nourish our good oral micro organism and that pertains to not simply cavities and gingivitis, however to, such as you mentioned, so many facets of well being. And I really feel like this isn’t talked about almost sufficient.
So in your view, what are a few of the issues we will do to nourish the nice micro organism in our mouth? And what are some issues to keep away from to maintain the unhealthy micro organism from getting too sturdy?
Naveen: After all, so initially, as you possibly can see there, , individuals have a look at the mouth as primarily as self-importance. Oh, I’ve nice whitened tooth. And didn’t imply, and other people consider unhealthy breath, oh, it’s only a unhealthy, , it’s a foul breath. It’s a symptom of issues already gone fallacious when you might have a foul breath. The query actually it’s important to ask your self is, what’s inflicting the unhealthy breath to occur?
And it might occur as a result of you might have a excessive sulfide manufacturing. So your mouth is begin to scent like this volcano, , sulfide, proper? So loads of the sulfide could be very unhealthy smelling. So when you might have a excessive sulfide manufacturing by your oral microbiome, you scent like sulfide.
Or you would be producing polyamine, which is one other, it’s like a rotten egg, principally. It’s like a rotten egg and you’ve got that scent. And now, curiously, identical kind of factor that you just talked about, the S Mutants and P. gingivitis and lots of different of those organisms, in truth, begin to work collectively. So when there’s a biofilm being shaped in your tooth, it seems that many of those micro organism are hydrophilic. Meaning they can’t truly keep on with your tooth. So there are different micro organism that come alongside, they will keep on with the tooth, and that enables the opposite sorts of micro organism to stay to those micro organism, they usually kind the movie, which is what we see once we get the plaque, and even once we get up within the morning, once you rub our tongue on the tooth, we get this slimy stuff. That’s your biofilm, proper?
Now to reply your query, what you are able to do is to actually have the oral probiotic and oral prebiotic and oral postbiotic. And Katie, we, as , when in our full physique intelligence check, we analyze your oral microbiome and the human gene expression on the identical time whereas we’re analyzing your intestine microbiome. And we’re additionally analyzing your blood so we will have a look at your mitochondria and we will additionally have a look at all of the genes which are expressed on the human aspect, together with your cytokines and the whole lot else. And all three mixed permits us to see what is occurring in your physique. And till now, we had been capable of provide the intestine probiotics and prebiotics to repair your intestine. We had been capable of customized make the dietary supplements for you that might truly deliver your physique again into the wholesome state.
And now within the subsequent, let’s see, mid-July, you’ll have the ability to get the oral lozenges for us. They are going to be personalised to you. So these oral lozenges will likely be personalised to every particular person and they’re going to have the ability to alter your oral microbiome, each from a probiotic, prebiotic and postbiotic perspective. That will likely be launching a customized toothpaste that will likely be made for you for AM and PM and that toothpaste once more goes to have all of the important oils, probiotics, prebiotics, the entire pure enzymes that your mouth wants to regulate the oral microbiome and one of many issues it’s going to do is to fully take away the plaque on contact.
And now we have now over 30 peer reviewed research that reveals clearly that by brushing with this personalised gel, it removes the plaque on contact. So I’m simply tremendous excited that now we’ll have the ability to alter the oral well being of individuals, which is known as a gateway to the human well being.
Katie: Yeah, and one thing else I like to focus on in the case of this matter is loads of the issues once we speak about micro organism that individuals may instinctively suppose to do in the event that they suppose they’re frightened about micro organism can truly make the issue worse. So from my understanding, these mouthwashes that we will get on the grocery retailer which have loads of alcohol in it or actually sturdy antibacterial stuff, they will truly kill the nice micro organism too and really result in the unhealthy micro organism getting additional out of stability. So I simply at all times like to focus on that. And I might love any enter you might have on that simply because I do know individuals generally hear micro organism and wanna go rush to kill the micro organism. However such as you’re saying, that’s not at all times the most suitable choice.
Naveen: Nicely, initially, give it some thought. Your physique wants these micro organism and these microbiomes. So let’s go larger, a much bigger image. Bear in mind, the microbiome means micro means small, biome means residing life. So this microbiome is actually not simply micro organism, it’s viruses, fungi, it’s mildew, it’s actually the entire stuff, yeast, the entire issues that we all know of, that now we have a primary ick issue, proper? Oh my God, I have to eliminate them. Guess what? We couldn’t reside with out them. They, in truth, are those in our intestine, in our mouth, that in our mouth, they pre-digest our meals. In our intestine, they actually ferment the fiber that our physique can’t digest and in flip give us the vitamins our physique wants, comparable to short-chain fatty acid, which is butyrate and acetate and propionate. All of these items are carried out by microbiome.
Our microbiome produces vitamin Ok. Actually, with out the microbiome in our physique, you wouldn’t have the ability to reside. Actually, once we do the testing on mice, mice, once we kill all of their intestine microbiome and the oral microbiome, principally they’re known as the mice that don’t have any microbes. They really don’t reside longer and they’re sicker on a regular basis. So our microbes truly maintain us wholesome and when the newborn is born to, the newborn is born by the delivery canal, it provides us a full publicity of microbiome to the newborn. Actually, the newborn, the microbiome is what’s draining the immune system for the newborn. So in truth, the infants get sicker as a result of their immune system not doesn’t perceive to start with what’s a good friend, what’s a foe. And our microbiome is consistently coaching our immune system. And that’s why as they get grownup, they’ve a mature microbiome, the microbiome that’s truly working with them.
And sadly, the infants which are born by C-section doesn’t generally get all of those microbes and that causes loads of the problems. So one factor you wanna be very clear is these microbes are your good friend. They aren’t your enemy. So taking antibiotics or taking a mouthwash that’s antibiotic mouthwash, you’re doing extra injury than good. Killing these microbes does injury to human well being interval. So don’t suppose that merely doing a mouthwash to really kill the micro organism which may be inflicting the unhealthy breath, you’re doing your self a favor. You’re additionally eliminating the micro organism that’s gonna produce the nitric oxide that your physique wants. That’s what’s gonna produce lot of the pre-digestive enzymes that our physique wants to have the ability to digest and take up the vitamins in our physique.
Katie: That’s an vital level. And one factor I’ve talked about somewhat bit on right here earlier than, however I’ll clarify in somewhat extra depth to your level is we’re first inoculated with all that vital intestine micro organism in the course of the birthing course of. And naturally, C sections are generally inevitable, like with my third. However one factor I realized was they will truly now do a swab of the mom’s micro organism and put it on the newborn even throughout a C-section. And the info I’ve seen on that’s actually fascinating so far as how that may truly assist infants have fewer charges of allergic reactions and eczema and loads of the issues that may include not getting that preliminary publicity.
I do know that additionally right here there may be that hyperlink between like we’ve talked about oral micro organism and the intestine micro organism. So I’d love to speak about any components that assist to encourage each of these. As an example, one I’ve seen recurring within the literature is consuming a variety of meals, clearly meals that you just don’t react to. However it looks as if many individuals immediately are consuming a really slim vary of the identical meals time and again and that our guts are inclined to thrive extra once we’re uncovered to all kinds of greens and herbs and spices that nourish the physique in numerous methods. However are you able to converse to that and any ideas for giving our micro organism or intestine micro organism what it must thrive?
Naveen: Positive. So Katie. I’m going to step again and simply perhaps describe to the viewers, individuals who might not have heard me earlier than about what’s it that we do. So I’m Founder and CEO of Viome. That’s V as in Victor, I-O-M-E. Viome Life Sciences. And we’re, very first thing we do is we analyze your gene expression. We analyze your RNA. We don’t analyze your DNA. We have a look at RNA. And for the individuals who might not be acquainted with what’s the distinction between DNA and RNA. So DNA by no means adjustments, proper? So if you happen to do a DNA check for me immediately and I acquire 200 kilos and also you do my one other DNA check, it’s nonetheless the identical. After which I grow to be diabetic and you are able to do my DNA continues to be the identical. Then I’ve melancholy, then I get anxiousness, then I get coronary heart assault. and also you do my DNA check once more, it’s the identical DNA. Actually, after I die, if you happen to had been to do my DNA check, but once more, years after I died, it’s nonetheless the identical DNA. We will nonetheless have a look at the DNA of reality in frequent or DNA of dinosaur. So the actual fact is your DNA can’t even let you know you’re useless or alive, not to mention you’re wholesome or sick.
What is consistently altering in your physique will not be your DNA, however your RNA, your gene expression is at all times altering. And for the people who find themselves questioning what’s a gene expression, the best way I’m able to perceive for myself is that each a part of our physique is an identical DNA. So my hair has the identical DNA as my pores and skin, my eyes, my lungs, my coronary heart, my kidney, my nails, my fingers, the whole lot is an identical DNA. But, I don’t have the eyes rising on my finger and the nails rising on my head, identical DNA. And the reason being some genes are overexpressed, some genes are beneath expressed, totally different genes are expressed, so identical DNA could make any a part of our physique. It makes our neurons in our mind and it makes the lungs, identical DNA.
RNA is the story you’re writing, DNA is like an alphabet. So what Viome does is it begins from the start to know what’s going on in your physique. So that you begin with the saliva. So that you order a package at viome.com. And when you get that package at residence, you ship us a spit of your saliva, 4 drops of your finger prick blood, and a contact of your stool. After which we begin to truly do the entire RNA evaluation of the whole lot you ship us. So we’re in your saliva, your whole oral microbial gene expression. So we all know what are they producing. After which we have a look at human gene expression in your saliva. Equally, within the blood, we’re ready to have a look at your whole mitochondrial gene expression and the human gene expression that comes out of your cytokines. Principally, these are the, , your immune system.
And within the intestine, we are actually your whole 30 trillion microbes and we’re analyzing their gene expression to see what they’re producing. After which we’re trying on the interplay between the entire microbial manufacturing, microbial metabolites and the human gene expression.
Now, as soon as now we have analyzed the whole lot, we let you know what is occurring in your physique. So we’ll let you know what’s your organic age, which is how nicely are you getting older or how poorly are you getting older, proper? So my chronological age is 64 and I’m biologically now all the way down to 52 proper? Now think about once I’m years outdated chronologically, I could possibly be 40 yr outdated biologically. So which means my spouse by no means must search for a younger man as a result of she’s already married a younger man, proper? In order that’s actually the trick is that we could be biologically youthful and despite the fact that we are literally chronologically getting older.
We offer you your immune well being, we offer you your intestine well being rating, we offer you your oral well being rating, we offer you your cognitive well being, we offer you your cardiac well being and we offer you 50 plus in-depth insights into your physique. After which we let you know, listed here are the meals you shouldn’t eat, and right here is why. Eat these meals, and right here is why. So for instance, there isn’t a such factor as common wholesome meals. Spinach could be good for you. And in reality, what we discover is of the individuals, spinach truly harms you as a result of your intestine microbes aren’t capable of digest oxalates correctly. Now, in case your intestine microbes are producing loads of sulfide, and the sulfide causes loads of irritation, then we all know the one strategy to produce excessive sulfide is that they want sulfate. And what are the meals excessive in sulfate? Broccoli, cabbage, brussels sprouts. So we are saying keep away from these meals.
Similar kind of factor, if we see you’re producing loads of ammonia, then we will say, hey, , your ammonia is coming from fermenting the protein. Meaning you’re taking loads of protein that’s not being digested. And you’ve got two selections. Take a digestive enzyme with that protein, or reduce down that protein. Equally, you possibly can have a look at uric acid and say, hey, don’t eat avocado, or don’t take vitamin B3, as a result of your uric acid manufacturing is simply too excessive. Or don’t take curcumin in case your bile acid manufacturing is simply too excessive. In order you possibly can see, there isn’t a such factor as common wholesome meals. And there’s no such factor as common wholesome complement. A identical meals could be good for you, or it may be unhealthy for you, relying on what’s occurring in a microbe. So. One man’s meals is one other man’s poison, and the identical meals that’s good for you immediately may very well be unhealthy for you six months from now as your microbes are continuously altering.
What we do curiously, Katie, is that when we notice what meals you want and what meals you shouldn’t eat, we additionally have a look at what vitamins your physique is presently missing. After which we will let you know that you just want on daily basis milligram of elderberry, milligram of berberine, you want milligram of amylase. And we undergo each vitamin, mineral, herbs, digestive enzyme, meals extracts, probiotics, prebiotics, and we customized make that for every particular person. Meaning there isn’t a pre-made stuff. We actually make the powder for every individual each single month. We put that powder within the capsule and we customized make these capsules for each particular person each month and we ship it to you.
So you possibly can see that the whole lot that you should maintain your physique wholesome and the whole lot you should maintain the intestine wholesome is one thing we use to offer. And now we will likely be including to it the oral lozenges so you possibly can alter the oral microbiome, the personalised toothpaste so you possibly can alter your oral microbiome. And we’re going to proceed doing an increasing number of issues. So at some point we will analyze your pores and skin microbiome and make the customized cream that’s truly going to be designed for every individual that’s going to be pores and skin cream. Think about if you happen to can analyze your scalp microbiome. We will do a customized shampoo and personalised hair conditioner for every particular person. And identical kind of issues, the meals which are good for you. So we let you know each single superfood. Meaning you want these superfoods. Now think about if we will make a superfood pack for every person who’s customized made for you. So that you’re not simply consuming the identical greens that everybody else is consuming. We take out the kale is dangerous to you or spinach is dangerous to your broccoli is dangerous to you. We will make the superfoods with solely the elements which are superfoods for you and that will likely be a customized made superfood. So we actually are , Katie, from our perspective, what can we do to personalize and customise each single factor that human beings want to remain wholesome each single day.
Katie: Yeah, it’s positively tremendous complete what you guys are doing. And I’d additionally like to springboard onto that as a result of I’ve grow to be a giant believer over time that we want that personalization and individualization. And I’ve spoken to that a lot of how we’re every so totally different. Such as you defined that we want personalised inputs. And whereas we would hear from an skilled who’s found out an ideal system, their system is not going to work precisely the identical for us, however that there additionally do appear to be some issues which are universally useful to us as human animals and that we sadly can’t or happily can’t put in a capsule, which I might put issues like daylight and nature publicity and sleep in that class. Like we all know the info on morning daylight and the way that impacts our circadian rhythm, how vibrant noon daylight and the pink gentle and blue gentle cost ourselves, how I’ve by no means heard a single skilled in 700 podcast episodes say sleep will not be completely very important to our well being.
So I might love to listen to your perspective from seeing all this knowledge for 1000’s of individuals. What are the opposite issues which are free that we will do at residence that make these items simpler?
Naveen: Completely. So initially, , if you happen to have a look at the longevity, there is sort of a hierarchy of wants and there are 5 issues that you should keep wholesome and keep longer and keep longer, more healthy. Proper? So primary is vitamin. I’ve talked sufficient about vitamin with out the right vitamin. Nothing issues. It’s like having a Ferrari, however not placing the best gasoline in that. So as soon as you bought within the vitamin taken care of, the subsequent step is definitely Katie, the stress, Stress Administration, proper? As a result of when your physique is beneath stress, it goes into combat or flight response. And sadly, when the physique is into the sympathetic mode, which is combat or flight response, it shuts down our digestive system. Bear in mind once we was in combat or flight as a result of we’ve been chased by a tiger, you don’t want to fret about truly digesting your meals since you’re about to grow to be a lunch for another person. Proper? And once we are pressured, our immune system truly stopped working as a result of it’s not, it’s not vital. Solely factor at that time vital is combat or flight. So which means your physique is able to combat or able to run. And that’s the rationale if you’re beneath stress, nothing works.
People who find themselves beneath stress get sick extra typically. They can’t digest the meals. So, , what do individuals do? earlier than they eat, we do gratitude, we do prayers. Why can we try this? It’s as a result of it brings the physique again from a sympathetic mode to parasympathetic mode. So which means you not beneath combat or combat response. So you possibly can digest your meals. And that’s the rationale that culturally we’re capable of do the gratitude earlier than we eat. So it permits us to digest our meals.
The quantity three factor is train. Now, I’m not suggesting that now we have to spend 4 hours or eight hours within the fitness center pumping iron, however all of us want to have the ability to do 45-minutes of quick strolling. Actually, if you may get 4, 5 miles, steps, a quick stroll, that’s adequate for most individuals. As we become older, it actually helps even to make use of your physique weight to do some muscle coaching. So whether or not you do push-up, you do pull-up, you are able to do squatting. I imply, it doesn’t require loads of tools. You are able to do it at residence. All the essential issues that you should do to remain wholesome.
The quantity 4 factor is sleep. And there’s a lot knowledge on sleep. Actually, it’s the high quality of sleep that issues simply as a lot as the amount of sleep. You will have to have the ability to get at the very least one and a half hour of deep sleep and at the very least one and a half hour of REM sleep. And since in the course of the REM sleep and deep sleep, not solely our physique is flooded with the fluid that really removes the rubbish from the mind, so it’s actually a cleansing drainage system that occurs once we are into the REM sleep or deep sleep. On the identical time, it additionally takes our short-term reminiscence, the whole lot we study, and it truly strikes right into a everlasting reminiscence. So it takes a short-term storage from hippocampus and it begins to maneuver the reminiscence into our new cortex. So all that occurs throughout sleep. And in reality, when individuals who don’t sleep nicely or sleep even 4 hours or 5 hours, they have a tendency to grow to be nearly as if they’re consuming and their mind fog, their power, and the entire programs are as if they’re drunk. So sleep is totally important for human well being.
And the final half, Katie, is discovering the aim. It’s actually vital that individuals who reside a lifetime of function are inclined to reside to years longer than the individuals don’t have any function. So do one thing that’s past you, simply good for you. Do one thing that’s significant for others. And the extra belongings you do to make different individuals’s life higher, the higher you may be having a greater life, a more healthy life, and reside longer.
Katie: Yeah, I completely agree on that. I do know we’ve had many private conversations alongside these strains and that for each of us, a giant a part of our function is enhancing the world for our children and for future generations and our kids typically being a giant focus.
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I might truly love to speak about updates somewhat bit as a result of I’ve gotten to know your daughter somewhat bit lately and he or she’s truly doing a little work much like what you’re doing in, however with the vaginal microbiome, which is one other new and rising space of analysis. And I feel additionally crucial to understanding this general microbial setting of the physique. So if you happen to don’t thoughts converse somewhat bit and humble brag in your daughter somewhat.
Naveen: Nicely, truly, I’m going to have you ever, since about vaginal microbiome and the way vital it’s to human well being, I’m going to have you ever speak about it and I’m going to let you know about what does it take to be an ideal father or mother and increase kids in a fluent household and even in a middle-class household that they actually have this starvation to exit and do audacious issues.
Katie: So briefly, I’ll contact on what she does and I’ll be certain that there’s a hyperlink within the present notes. If you happen to guys need to continue learning extra, they’ve loads of instructional assets too. However I really feel like that is an space of drugs that has been largely ignored for a protracted, very long time, as a result of for almost all of our recorded historical past, at the very least nearly all of researchers and docs had been males. So it was a considerably ignored space.
However like we talked about earlier, we all know that the mother’s microbiome, together with her vaginal microbiome impacts a child’s lifelong well being. And so from my understanding, what your daughter’s doing is making testing out there at residence to the on a regular basis individual to know what’s going on in their very own vaginal microbiome and enhance it, identical to we’ve talked about with the mouth, with the intestine. And I really feel like for ladies, this can be a actually vital space that we now have entry to know at a deeper stage. And that equally will hopefully information us within the path of excellent practices that aren’t going to destroy our microbiome and that may assist us enhance it, which is very vital for anybody who’s contemplating having a child. In order that’s her product and her firm. I’ll be certain that it’s linked to as nicely.
However I do know a function and a ardour you and I each deeply share is the significance of elevating youngsters who’re type and who’re innovators and who additionally wanna assist make the world a greater place and that we’ve each taken some counterintuitive approaches to this and that we regularly get to check notes on it. I might say for me, it comes from beginning with a form of abilities up versus data down method and what are the long-term objectives, the issues I hope to impart to them after which how do I finest nurture that? And once we have a look at it by that lens, typically the issues that we’d suppose to do as dad and mom won’t truly be the most effective method. And so I attempt to deal with core qualities like creativity and considering outdoors the field and asking good questions and letting their motivation come from inside them versus me being their exogenous rule enforcer or motivation. However I like once you speak about this. So let’s shift gears and speak about parenting somewhat.
Naveen: So initially, Katie, I’ve three kids and my oldest is Angkor and he runs an organization known as B-I-L-T, B-I-L-T. And he basically began this firm, Bilt Rewards, for one easy purpose. He thought that many people who’re renting a spot won’t ever ever construct any fairness. We’re continuously maintain losing cash away. So he thought, what if he can create a bank card that has no annual price and you’ll pay the lease on a bank card and there’s no bank card price, so that you don’t must pay or bank card price. And you continue to earn the factors on each single spend that you just do. And you should use these factors to really pay the subsequent month lease or you should use them to purchase a house or you should use them one-on-one-on any airways you need, proper? Unbelievable what he did. And that firm inside a yr is now value over $1.5 billion. It’s processing over six billion already in lower than one yr as a result of he took on this audacious concept that would assist the entire center class of the nation. And he’s a Wharton grad.
And my daughter that you just talked about, Priyanka, she went to Stanford. She’s the Stanford STEM fellow. She’s the Stanford Mayfield fellow. And the primary firm she did was truly use AI to take away the gender bias. After which she received actually passionate in regards to the ladies’s well being. And what actually received to her was as soon as she realized that it’s not the researchers are all males. The ladies weren’t even allowed to be within the scientific analysis till ‘93. Meaning nearly each drug that ladies takes immediately isn’t being examined on ladies. And there’s no surprise that it really works much less on ladies. Ladies are identified seven years later for a similar illness. And the medication have by no means truly examined on ladies that they even work on ladies. And she or he determined she was going to tackle this problem of girls’s well being. And she or he began with a vaginal microbiome. And the corporate is known as Evvy. E as in Edward, V-V-Y, evvy.com. And… at residence check for vaginal microbiome.
And what’s superb is that ladies endure by so most of the vaginal illnesses, however they’re ashamed to go speak about that, proper? And she or he determined she’s gonna take the stigma off and actually permit ladies to know what’s going on and create a community the place they will now speak to a health care provider with the outcomes so they can truly let you know, that is what you should do and that is what’s actually occurring. And it seems the vaginal microbiome is the primary predictor of preterm delivery. It’s the primary predictor of the well being of the newborn. Along with clearly the intestine well being and the oral well being, it’s a key a part of the ladies’s well being in any respect.
And our youngest one, by the best way, simply to finish, is Neil. And he’s additionally a Stanford grad, and he’s a Schwarzman scholar. And he’s operating an organization known as Velen, which basically is totally rethinking how we purchase properties and the way we pay for our properties and mortgages. So actually all ends of the spectrum of creating positive that they proceed to deal with issues that may assist billions of individuals reside a greater life. As a result of I actually consider the success is outlined by not how a lot cash you might have within the financial institution, however how many individuals’s lives you contact. Now, coming again on the parenting aspect is that it’s counterintuitive. Every part that we consider we’re doing it for them may very well be harming them. And all of us consider that it’s the enforcer rule of a father or mother, that taking them to the water and making them drink. And what I spotted was our job as dad and mom is to make them thirsty. And the best way to make them thirsty is to make them intellectually curious. As soon as we create the curious youngsters, they discover their very own water, and they’re going to drink. And that mental curiosity is created by permitting them to consider the whole lot is feasible.
So we speak about, even when, as an alternative of studying them the story after they had been younger, I might ask them to inform me a narrative about three issues that I may discover that might by no means be linked collectively. And I might ask them to inform me a narrative a couple of monkey, an ocean, and a palm tree. And so they must now join the issues collectively that couldn’t be linked in the true world.
And the rationale we did that was permit them to suppose that how determined trying issues can truly be linked. And it permits them to create new neural connection of their mind. So they are going to ask, OK, dad, now you get to inform me a narrative a couple of glass and a leaf and a tree. And the way do you join all of them collectively? So level was that we’ll problem one another to attach the issues which are by no means linked.
Now equally, the opposite half was redefining success for them. So let’s say we at all times instructed them their success will at all times be measured by what number of lives they enhance. We instructed them that their self-worth will not be gonna come from what they personal, but it surely comes from what they create. Meaning you would inherit some huge cash, however you’re nonetheless a parasite on society if you happen to’re not doing something to contribute again to the society, proper? Different half that’s typically is most individuals, how would I say, name it very controversial. I really feel that kids need to see their dad and mom as a job mannequin. They don’t need to hearken to what they must say. They really watch them do the issues they do moderately than inform them the issues that they inform, proper? So it’s the kids truly do what they see you do, not what you inform them. So if you happen to say, hey, cash doesn’t matter, and also you’re continuously chasing cash, they know, they see by that. If you happen to make some huge cash and also you say, look, I’m going to now sit at residence and never do the rest as an alternative of going out and persevering with to enhance the world. And you then inform them, hey, guess what? Our function in life to continuously enhance the world, however I’m sitting at residence watching CNBC. What occurs is youngsters see by that. After they go to highschool, in the event that they see the dad sitting at residence watching CNBC, they arrive again from faculty, I inform them, go work laborious. Exhausting work is what it takes. And by the best way, they see the dad sitting at residence watching CNBC. What are they considering? I’m going to develop up identical to my dad did.
Then Katie after my first firm turned wildly profitable. I began the second firm, the third firm, and the fourth firm. After which I mentioned, we’re going to go to the moon and created Moon Categorical to settle and received a billion NASA contract. It began wild. Even the age of I wished them to see, age doesn’t matter. You possibly can tackle an audacious problem, even within the space that you could be not know a lot about. And that’s actually the sensation I wished them to have. Simply because they’re non-experts, it isn’t their legal responsibility. Being a non-expert is their asset as a result of they can problem the whole lot that the specialists have taken it as a right. And that enables them to really rethink, reimagine, and recreate one thing that no skilled will do.
And I feel that is most likely the saddest factor to say is that it doesn’t matter how sensible you’re, youngsters thoughts, your dad and mom will at all times be morons. And the actual fact is our children will at all times say, oh my God, daddy’s not even that sensible. If he can do that, we will do 10 occasions higher. So let’s go tackle even a much bigger problem than what daddy’s doing. And that to me is music to my ears. And the actual fact is you and I each have talked about it. Nothing brings us extra pleasure to our life than to see our children do some superb issues, not simply generate income, however actually exit and do issues that enhance different individuals’s lives.
And I’ve met your youngsters, Katie, and all I can let you know that you’ve been an unbelievable mom. You will have devoted your life to serving to them. You will have devoted your life to educating them in a approach that not solely they’re type and fantastic kids, they’re very sensible and really curious kids. And I met your son, and , I feel he’s going to do some nice issues in life. And I can’t look forward to him to return even to an internship with us, or to a met, , if I may mentor him, as a result of I actually suppose your youngsters at some point are going to be not solely within the information, they’re going to alter the best way individuals reside their lives. I can’t wait to examine them and saying, God, I knew that they had been nonetheless in diapers.
Katie: Oh, thanks. And I like that. I like that you just’re forward of me on the parenting curve so I can study from you. And I like that we get to have these conversations and to echo your level, I feel I’ve realized that lesson time and again as a mother, the significance of modeling and the way, such as you mentioned, we will say issues all day lengthy, but it surely’s what we truly try this they take note of. And that’s the rationale us specializing in our personal well being and health as adults is so vital as a result of that offers them permission to do it. It’s why us having our personal curiosity and persevering with to study new issues each single day is vital as a result of that offers them permission to do it.
And I such as you approached the concept of parenting that they aren’t mine. I don’t personal them within the least that they’re every their very own infinite autonomous beings that I get the honour of being their mother on this lifetime and to go on this journey with them. However on the finish of the day, such as you mentioned, I hope that thirst comes from inside them and never as a result of they really feel expectation of me, however as a result of they’ve that curiosity and that need to assist people who hopefully they will study by my instance and thru the instance of so many different individuals and thru superb books and thru associates such as you. So I like that we at all times, it doesn’t matter what, we at all times ended up getting within the matter of parenting. I feel well being is in fact extraordinarily vital. And I might say parenting is equally vital for these of us who’ve youngsters. So I like that we at all times get to go in that path.
Additionally a few final questions which are extraordinarily egocentric for me as a result of I at all times love studying from you. The primary being: any ebook, a ebook or variety of books which have had a profound affect on you personally, and in that case, what they’re and why.
Naveen: Nicely, , I learn all sorts of books. And, , so these are going to be random books. I simply completed studying a ebook known as Existential Physics. And it talks about from a perspective of physics, when somebody dies, are they nonetheless alive? And it’s simply actually thought upsetting concept. Is there a soul? Is there a multiverse? So this actually seems to be in any respect the issues we usually ask one another. And what’s actually fascinating was that even when your grandmother you suppose is useless, if somebody, and let’s assume she died years in the past, when somebody is definitely watching Earth from hundred gentle years away, they’re nonetheless watching her stroll as a result of gentle takes years to succeed in them, they usually’re nonetheless watching her in her mid-40s and really mid-30s, having nice time on Earth. So far as they’re involved, she’s nonetheless alive. So the concept of this, whether or not somebody is alive or useless, whether or not they exist or don’t exist, can we as people truly are, exist in any respect as a result of everyone knows that we’re made from atoms and atoms are made from electrons and protons, they’re made from quarts and principally we’re a bundle of power despite the fact that once we contact us we really feel strong however we all know it’s not, it’s simply power and our haptic senses are fooling us. So anyway that’s an ideal ebook by way of understanding from physics perspective what’s there, what will not be there.
The opposite ebook I learn was Thousand Brains by Jeff Hawkins, and it actually talks about how our human mind works. What’s actually fascinating in that ebook was, we at all times thought that our mind works like a neural community. It has a number of layers and every layer truly provides worth to the earlier layer. On this ebook, it talks about that each piece of our neocortex is a column, and every column can compute fully, and it principally does the likelihood statistics and votes to say, is that this this or this? And it’s actually the polling that’s occurring within the mind that decides what is true and what’s fallacious. I believed it was a very fascinating ebook.
The ebook, one other ebook that I simply completed studying is Why Sleep Issues by Matthew Walker, unbelievably nice sleep scientist and actually explains in nice element why sleep is so vital and he’s linked sleep instantly causatively to metabolic issues like diabetes, weight problems and most cancers and lots of different illnesses that may instantly be associated to individuals who truly get a scarcity of sleep and it might causatively not simply affiliation however causatively how these items all join collectively. So I feel it was only a actually fascinating ebook to see that why we attempt to consider that it’s a macho factor to do to not sleep but it surely’s actually vital to your well being to really get a great evening’s sleep.
Katie: I’ll add all three of these to my studying checklist and likewise to the present notes for you guys listening. They’ll be at wellnessmama.fm together with hyperlinks to Viome and Evvy and all the opposite issues we’ve talked about. And lastly, Naveen, any parting recommendation for the listeners immediately that could possibly be associated to one thing we’ve talked about or solely unrelated life recommendation?
Naveen: Nicely, I feel to me is that by no means cease dreaming. And I feel lots of people round you’ll at all times begin to deliver you down and let you know, simply since you’re a lady, you can not try this. Simply since you’re brown, you can not try this. Simply since you come from this poor background, you can not try this. Or simply as a result of you haven’t any data of this trade, you can not try this. The very fact is, don’t let somebody outline who you’re. The way in which I simply, , for me is fall in love with your self as a result of the day you fall in love with your self is the day the world will fall in love with you. You don’t want another person’s approval so that you can pursue your goals. The dream’s so huge that individuals suppose you’re loopy and at all times do not forget that you solely fail once you surrender and also you, , your concept might or might not work, however each concept that doesn’t work is solely a stepping stone to a unique concept and a much bigger concept. So my recommendation at all times is, … Fall in love with your self, pursue your goals, and don’t let anybody ever let you know that you would be able to’t do them.
Katie: I feel that’s an ideal place to wrap up for immediately. Naveen, it’s at all times a pleasure to have a dialog with you. Thanks a lot to your time and for sharing immediately.
Naveen: Thanks Katie, it’s at all times an honor and a pleasure and I at all times take pleasure in your constructive power and love speaking about your kids.
Katie: Oh, nicely, thanks. And thanks as at all times to all of you for listening and sharing your most dear assets, your time, your power, and your consideration with us immediately. We’re each so grateful that you just did. And I hope that you’ll be a part of me once more on the subsequent episode of The Wellness Mama Podcast.
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